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	<title>Comments on: Cox Commission II hearing</title>
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	<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/</link>
	<description>Covering the Military Justice System</description>
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		<title>By: V'ERPA LLC</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8334</link>
		<dc:creator>V'ERPA LLC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 15:45:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8334</guid>
		<description>For the record, &quot;two spokespeople for a veterans&#039; group&quot; was Ms. Leigh E. Wise (USAF (Ret.) and Jeffrey A. Trueman, Founder, V&#039;ERPA LLC.  (www.verpapublishing.us).  As we presented, the UCMJ did not work in the Wise-Matter at great cost to the public and the member.  &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Our testimony will be cited on our web site ... and we feel our presentation was the most comprehensive of all - - with regard to the UCMJ and its failures.  Once again, the &quot;victims&quot; of UCMJ injustices and even with the prevailing case status—without lawyers assistance are being left out of the public domain.  It makes us wonder … what is truly going one here.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In short, for a non-profit organization who traveled from Georgia to Washington to speak on behalf of many, as we did a decade ago... we are sad that we could not be cited by name and legal title as the others.  &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;We await the findings and conclusions of this panel... and will comment further when that happens.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The V&#039;ERPA-TEAM</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For the record, &quot;two spokespeople for a veterans&#39; group&quot; was Ms. Leigh E. Wise (USAF (Ret.) and Jeffrey A. Trueman, Founder, V&#39;ERPA LLC.  (www.verpapublishing.us).  As we presented, the UCMJ did not work in the Wise-Matter at great cost to the public and the member.  </p>
<p>Our testimony will be cited on our web site &#8230; and we feel our presentation was the most comprehensive of all &#8211; - with regard to the UCMJ and its failures.  Once again, the &quot;victims&quot; of UCMJ injustices and even with the prevailing case status—without lawyers assistance are being left out of the public domain.  It makes us wonder … what is truly going one here.</p>
<p>In short, for a non-profit organization who traveled from Georgia to Washington to speak on behalf of many, as we did a decade ago&#8230; we are sad that we could not be cited by name and legal title as the others.  </p>
<p>We await the findings and conclusions of this panel&#8230; and will comment further when that happens.</p>
<p>The V&#39;ERPA-TEAM</p>
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		<title>By: John O'Connor</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8093</link>
		<dc:creator>John O'Connor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 19:04:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8093</guid>
		<description>Well, Denedo seems to find that the CCA would have jurisdiction for that writ.  A week ago I would have said the answer was an Article III court.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;But my larger point is that there&#039;s no law that makes an accused take sentencing relief in return for a waiver of appellate rights.  I don&#039;t think it&#039;s overly harsh to say that if you don&#039;t want to live with the sentence you can negotiate, then either plead guilty without a deal or plead no guilty.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The idea is to reach a landing point where an accused says &quot;look, if I can have THAT deal, I won&#039;t complain about any conviction or sentence within the range permitted by the PTA.&quot;  I assume MJs would develop rather explicit instructions to be provided during the providence inquiry on that issue in terms of what the accused is giving up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, Denedo seems to find that the CCA would have jurisdiction for that writ.  A week ago I would have said the answer was an Article III court.</p>
<p>But my larger point is that there&#39;s no law that makes an accused take sentencing relief in return for a waiver of appellate rights.  I don&#39;t think it&#39;s overly harsh to say that if you don&#39;t want to live with the sentence you can negotiate, then either plead guilty without a deal or plead no guilty.</p>
<p>The idea is to reach a landing point where an accused says &quot;look, if I can have THAT deal, I won&#39;t complain about any conviction or sentence within the range permitted by the PTA.&quot;  I assume MJs would develop rather explicit instructions to be provided during the providence inquiry on that issue in terms of what the accused is giving up.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Wright</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8092</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Wright</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 18:52:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8092</guid>
		<description>Last Post:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;JO’C&lt;br /&gt;One issue that your article did discuss —but I still think it’s of a concern—is how to deal with cases where even if the accused has pled guilty they do need some type of relief.  I’m thinking of real ineffective assistance of counsel cases, coerced pleas, an accused wanting to withdraw his plea, Denando type cases, incorrect or unlawful sentences, problems with convening authority action, and other post-trial problems. (Let’s assume, for example, that Denando discovered he was now getting deported relatively soon after he pled guilty at his court-martial).  Of course, the convening authority could correct the problem, or not approve the court-martial and order a rehearing.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In the civilian world, with standing courts, these types of collateral attacks on a guilty plea can be just brought back before the original court and relief can be sought, but since courts-martial are such fleeting things the only way to get relief is on direct appeal.  So if waiver of appellant review becomes standard in all PTA’s where would the accused go for relief?  Federal courts?  I guess Coram Nobis writs are now good to go, but would the CCA have jurisdiction or the original court-martial? &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;This is certainly not meant to be a criticism of any kind, but just a follow up question.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;(If this has already been discussed before on the Blog just post the link.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Last Post:</p>
<p>JO’C<br />One issue that your article did discuss —but I still think it’s of a concern—is how to deal with cases where even if the accused has pled guilty they do need some type of relief.  I’m thinking of real ineffective assistance of counsel cases, coerced pleas, an accused wanting to withdraw his plea, Denando type cases, incorrect or unlawful sentences, problems with convening authority action, and other post-trial problems. (Let’s assume, for example, that Denando discovered he was now getting deported relatively soon after he pled guilty at his court-martial).  Of course, the convening authority could correct the problem, or not approve the court-martial and order a rehearing.</p>
<p>In the civilian world, with standing courts, these types of collateral attacks on a guilty plea can be just brought back before the original court and relief can be sought, but since courts-martial are such fleeting things the only way to get relief is on direct appeal.  So if waiver of appellant review becomes standard in all PTA’s where would the accused go for relief?  Federal courts?  I guess Coram Nobis writs are now good to go, but would the CCA have jurisdiction or the original court-martial? </p>
<p>This is certainly not meant to be a criticism of any kind, but just a follow up question.</p>
<p>(If this has already been discussed before on the Blog just post the link.)</p>
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		<title>By: John O'Connor</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8091</link>
		<dc:creator>John O'Connor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 18:43:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8091</guid>
		<description>Peter Wright:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Thanks for the kind words.  Dwight posted my article when it first appeared in (I think) late 2007.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;You asked about my view of &quot;more comprehensive&quot; changes, such as making all cases appealable, or not making any appeals automatic.  I find it completely unworkable from a practical standpoint to require a notice of appeal.  First, I assume the result would be that everyone notices an appeal -- it would just be one more piece of paper that would be signed in the DC&#039;s office along with appellate rights statements, etc.  The reason is that there is no cost to an accused for an appeal if he uses military counsel.  So why wouldn&#039;t you noticve the appeal if it&#039;s free (and if the DC would risk an IAC claim if he didn&#039;t make you do it). &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Second, because all court-martial appeals are geographically located in the greater D.C. area, it&#039;s impractical for trial counsel to stay with trhe case on appeal (and would probably be bad for accuseds anyway in terms of technical appellate competence).  That means that the system more or less has to have new appellate counsel assigned who have had no prior contact with the accused.  Given that geographic realities reduce attorney-client contact on appeal, I think any system that requires affirmative opt-in for an appeal is problematic.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;As for making currently sub-jurisdictional issues subject to Article 66 review, that&#039;s Dwight&#039;s issue not mine.  I see Dwight has recommended that mandatory Article 66 review (in the absence of a waiver) occur for &quot;subjurisdictional&quot; cases where there was an approved guilty finding for a spec to which the accused pleaded not guilty.  If we allowed for PTAs with appellate review waivers, I&#039;d take that modest subjurisdictional review because the overall package would be an improvement, but you won&#039;t see me lobbying for expanded review of &quot;subjurisdictional&quot; cases.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peter Wright:</p>
<p>Thanks for the kind words.  Dwight posted my article when it first appeared in (I think) late 2007.</p>
<p>You asked about my view of &quot;more comprehensive&quot; changes, such as making all cases appealable, or not making any appeals automatic.  I find it completely unworkable from a practical standpoint to require a notice of appeal.  First, I assume the result would be that everyone notices an appeal &#8212; it would just be one more piece of paper that would be signed in the DC&#39;s office along with appellate rights statements, etc.  The reason is that there is no cost to an accused for an appeal if he uses military counsel.  So why wouldn&#39;t you noticve the appeal if it&#39;s free (and if the DC would risk an IAC claim if he didn&#39;t make you do it). </p>
<p>Second, because all court-martial appeals are geographically located in the greater D.C. area, it&#39;s impractical for trial counsel to stay with trhe case on appeal (and would probably be bad for accuseds anyway in terms of technical appellate competence).  That means that the system more or less has to have new appellate counsel assigned who have had no prior contact with the accused.  Given that geographic realities reduce attorney-client contact on appeal, I think any system that requires affirmative opt-in for an appeal is problematic.</p>
<p>As for making currently sub-jurisdictional issues subject to Article 66 review, that&#39;s Dwight&#39;s issue not mine.  I see Dwight has recommended that mandatory Article 66 review (in the absence of a waiver) occur for &quot;subjurisdictional&quot; cases where there was an approved guilty finding for a spec to which the accused pleaded not guilty.  If we allowed for PTAs with appellate review waivers, I&#39;d take that modest subjurisdictional review because the overall package would be an improvement, but you won&#39;t see me lobbying for expanded review of &quot;subjurisdictional&quot; cases.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Wright</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8090</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Wright</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 17:54:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8090</guid>
		<description>JO’C&lt;br /&gt;Great article!  I read the whole thing and completely agree with it.  I’ve commented a couple of times about some of the issues in the article.  Last week I got into a debate with Socrates about whether the accused at least had a duty to keep in touch with his appellant counsel.  I guess I can comment a lot less now and just refer my point to your article.  (Did I miss it when it was posted on CAAFLOG before?  I kind of feel stupid for bringing those issues up when your article already has done a pretty exhaustive review of it.  I think I’ll go back to spending more of my time at work doing my real work—or just spend more time reading the ONION.)&lt;br /&gt; &lt;br /&gt;1)  Completely agree with your point about guilty plea appeals diverting judicial resources from contested cases.  I got detailed to a few kicked back contested cases that were literally YEARS old.  They were relatively simple issues that got them reversed and I couldn’t believe it took so long for them to be decided.  I almost felt bad for the poor trial counsel who had to track down the witnesses.  One case was a UA case and they had to bring two doctors back from retirement and spend a lot money flying in almost all the witnesses.  And in the end, the members gave us a great sentence because they were upset that the legal office took so long for a simple UA case. (Actual juror’s note to the MJ after the court).&lt;br /&gt;  &lt;br /&gt;2)  Great point about with the UCMJ not permitting any no-contest pleas or Alfred pleas, there is very little moral justification for spending so much time on those cases.  The accused can’t even plausibility claim that they were really innocent and just got railroaded into pleading.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;3)  Your point of allowing the accused to waive appellant review is a great first step, and sometimes you’ve got to move slowly with these things, but what’s your general position on more comprehensive changes.  Like no automatic appeals and/or allowing all convicted accused the right to appeal.  In many ways, in today’s world, it’s the conviction itself that is the stain on the accused’s record; a BCD is more just like firing and employee and giving a bad reference.  All employers ask if you have a conviction, but it’s much less common today, with less of the population serving in the military, to ask if you got an honorable discharge.&lt;br /&gt;I had several cases where I strongly suspect the MJ gave a subjurisdictional sentence with the sole purpose of avoiding direct appellant review.  In one case, we argued for a BCD and the MJ just gave confinement.  Afterward I asked why no BCD? and it’s burned in my memory what he said –perhaps a little too candidly— “There was no way I was going to let that case go up on appeal.”  (There was no PTA and we had a pretrial punishment motion that he denied.)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;4)  On page 218 you use the phrase “bareback special” I’ve certainty used those types of PTA’s, but I’ve never heard of it phrased that way.  The only time I’ve heard the term “bareback” is to describe something slightly more tawdry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JO’C<br />Great article!  I read the whole thing and completely agree with it.  I’ve commented a couple of times about some of the issues in the article.  Last week I got into a debate with Socrates about whether the accused at least had a duty to keep in touch with his appellant counsel.  I guess I can comment a lot less now and just refer my point to your article.  (Did I miss it when it was posted on CAAFLOG before?  I kind of feel stupid for bringing those issues up when your article already has done a pretty exhaustive review of it.  I think I’ll go back to spending more of my time at work doing my real work—or just spend more time reading the ONION.)</p>
<p>1)  Completely agree with your point about guilty plea appeals diverting judicial resources from contested cases.  I got detailed to a few kicked back contested cases that were literally YEARS old.  They were relatively simple issues that got them reversed and I couldn’t believe it took so long for them to be decided.  I almost felt bad for the poor trial counsel who had to track down the witnesses.  One case was a UA case and they had to bring two doctors back from retirement and spend a lot money flying in almost all the witnesses.  And in the end, the members gave us a great sentence because they were upset that the legal office took so long for a simple UA case. (Actual juror’s note to the MJ after the court).</p>
<p>2)  Great point about with the UCMJ not permitting any no-contest pleas or Alfred pleas, there is very little moral justification for spending so much time on those cases.  The accused can’t even plausibility claim that they were really innocent and just got railroaded into pleading.</p>
<p>3)  Your point of allowing the accused to waive appellant review is a great first step, and sometimes you’ve got to move slowly with these things, but what’s your general position on more comprehensive changes.  Like no automatic appeals and/or allowing all convicted accused the right to appeal.  In many ways, in today’s world, it’s the conviction itself that is the stain on the accused’s record; a BCD is more just like firing and employee and giving a bad reference.  All employers ask if you have a conviction, but it’s much less common today, with less of the population serving in the military, to ask if you got an honorable discharge.<br />I had several cases where I strongly suspect the MJ gave a subjurisdictional sentence with the sole purpose of avoiding direct appellant review.  In one case, we argued for a BCD and the MJ just gave confinement.  Afterward I asked why no BCD? and it’s burned in my memory what he said –perhaps a little too candidly— “There was no way I was going to let that case go up on appeal.”  (There was no PTA and we had a pretrial punishment motion that he denied.)</p>
<p>4)  On page 218 you use the phrase “bareback special” I’ve certainty used those types of PTA’s, but I’ve never heard of it phrased that way.  The only time I’ve heard the term “bareback” is to describe something slightly more tawdry.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8089</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 17:40:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8089</guid>
		<description>Could you provide any more detail on the state innovations discussed by Cully Stimson?  He had a good post here about a year ago suggesting a number of prosecution-related improvements drawn from state practices, but I never saw any follow-up from him regarding defense-oriented improvements.  I&#039;m just curious if any were mentioned in his comments to the commission.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Could you provide any more detail on the state innovations discussed by Cully Stimson?  He had a good post here about a year ago suggesting a number of prosecution-related improvements drawn from state practices, but I never saw any follow-up from him regarding defense-oriented improvements.  I&#39;m just curious if any were mentioned in his comments to the commission.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8088</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 16:40:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8088</guid>
		<description>Then the commission has done its work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Then the commission has done its work.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8083</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 13:49:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8083</guid>
		<description>So the commission writes a report. Then what?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So the commission writes a report. Then what?</p>
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		<title>By: Eugene R. Fidell</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2009/06/17/cox-commission-ii-hearing/comment-page-1/#comment-8081</link>
		<dc:creator>Eugene R. Fidell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 04:16:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tx18.westnic.net/~caaflog/?p=2113#comment-8081</guid>
		<description>The link was live only during the hearing. Once NIMJ has a DVD of the proceedings we hope to post it on our website, www.nimj.org.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The link was live only during the hearing. Once NIMJ has a DVD of the proceedings we hope to post it on our website, <a href="http://www.nimj.org" rel="nofollow">http://www.nimj.org</a>.</p>
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