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	<title>Comments on: CAAF won&#8217;t hear amicus oral argument from NACDL in Diaz, but will hear amicus argument from Pepperdine law students</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/</link>
	<description>Covering the Military Justice System</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 07 Sep 2010 01:07:23 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Atticus</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12067</link>
		<dc:creator>Atticus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Feb 2010 14:44:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12067</guid>
		<description>I did a number of outreach arguments and in only one did either the law students or an amicus do a half-decent job.  The rest of them it was deer-in-the-headlights time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did a number of outreach arguments and in only one did either the law students or an amicus do a half-decent job.  The rest of them it was deer-in-the-headlights time.</p>
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		<title>By: EXCELSIOR</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12039</link>
		<dc:creator>EXCELSIOR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Feb 2010 03:55:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12039</guid>
		<description>Yeah, those CAAF travel expenses are really breaking the federal government&#039;s bank.  Much bigger problem than fat cat subsidies, starting a war in Iraq, etc.  Get real.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, those CAAF travel expenses are really breaking the federal government&#8217;s bank.  Much bigger problem than fat cat subsidies, starting a war in Iraq, etc.  Get real.</p>
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		<title>By: Dew_Process</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12037</link>
		<dc:creator>Dew_Process</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 21:30:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12037</guid>
		<description>First of all, does anyone have access to the Pepperdine Amicus Brief who could either provide it to CAAFlog or tell us what issue(s) they briefed and their arguments?  I know that the NACDL Amicus Brief was previously posted here.

I don&#039;t have any problem with allowing law students to file an Amicus Brief [even out of time], but to elevate them above a bona fide Amicus for purposes of oral argument is both nuts and demeaning to the Court itself.  But, I suspect that it is the proverbial pay back for Pepperdine&#039;s agreeing to host the Court.  Strange process.

In seeking permission from CAAF for Amicus status in support of Diaz, NACDL claimed a two-fold &quot;interest&quot; in the case:

   &quot;First, the issues pertain to a core Constitutional issue, the Sixth Amendment “Right to Present a Defense.”  NACDL institutionally as well as its members have a significant interest in safeguarding that right on behalf of our clients.  Second, this case involves issues under the federal Espionage Act, 18 U.S.C. § 793, as well as security “classification” issues that arose at the U.S. Naval Station at Guantanamo [GTMO] Bay, Cuba.&quot;

Noting that many of its members were either defending GTMO prisoners or were involved in on-going Espionage Act litigation.

And I totally agree that in this era of federal &quot;belt tightening,&quot; it is irresponsible for CAAF to spend appropriated funds for a winter trip to California [they are at Camp Pendleton the day after Diaz].</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First of all, does anyone have access to the Pepperdine Amicus Brief who could either provide it to CAAFlog or tell us what issue(s) they briefed and their arguments?  I know that the NACDL Amicus Brief was previously posted here.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t have any problem with allowing law students to file an Amicus Brief [even out of time], but to elevate them above a bona fide Amicus for purposes of oral argument is both nuts and demeaning to the Court itself.  But, I suspect that it is the proverbial pay back for Pepperdine&#8217;s agreeing to host the Court.  Strange process.</p>
<p>In seeking permission from CAAF for Amicus status in support of Diaz, NACDL claimed a two-fold &#8220;interest&#8221; in the case:</p>
<p>   &#8220;First, the issues pertain to a core Constitutional issue, the Sixth Amendment “Right to Present a Defense.”  NACDL institutionally as well as its members have a significant interest in safeguarding that right on behalf of our clients.  Second, this case involves issues under the federal Espionage Act, 18 U.S.C. § 793, as well as security “classification” issues that arose at the U.S. Naval Station at Guantanamo [GTMO] Bay, Cuba.&#8221;</p>
<p>Noting that many of its members were either defending GTMO prisoners or were involved in on-going Espionage Act litigation.</p>
<p>And I totally agree that in this era of federal &#8220;belt tightening,&#8221; it is irresponsible for CAAF to spend appropriated funds for a winter trip to California [they are at Camp Pendleton the day after Diaz].</p>
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		<title>By: Cloudesley Shovell</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12033</link>
		<dc:creator>Cloudesley Shovell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 18:37:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12033</guid>
		<description>S G--Thank you sir, and you are quite correct.  Not that I have anything against watery tarts or women lyin&#039; around in ponds in general, you know.  Except for the one who stole my emerald ring.  Time for another field trip to Porthellick Cove!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>S G&#8211;Thank you sir, and you are quite correct.  Not that I have anything against watery tarts or women lyin&#8217; around in ponds in general, you know.  Except for the one who stole my emerald ring.  Time for another field trip to Porthellick Cove!</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12030</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 17:07:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12030</guid>
		<description>Can&#039;t we just outsource our entire appellate operations to law students?  Great experience for them.  And since their &quot;blowing us out of the water&quot; anyway...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Can&#8217;t we just outsource our entire appellate operations to law students?  Great experience for them.  And since their &#8220;blowing us out of the water&#8221; anyway&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12028</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 15:08:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12028</guid>
		<description>What happened to Obama&#039;s spending freeze?  CAAF should not go on another oral argument trip for 3 years!  Do CAAF judges follow the rules, or just make their own?    Get with the program, out-of-touch judge dudes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What happened to Obama&#8217;s spending freeze?  CAAF should not go on another oral argument trip for 3 years!  Do CAAF judges follow the rules, or just make their own?    Get with the program, out-of-touch judge dudes.</p>
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		<title>By: Southern Defense Counsel</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12027</link>
		<dc:creator>Southern Defense Counsel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 14:23:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12027</guid>
		<description>If they are going to have project outreach, it seems appropriate that they let the students participate. (As for the out of time filing, that&#039;s a whole different issue - assuming the students had notice and could have filed within time I&#039;d say bugger off).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If they are going to have project outreach, it seems appropriate that they let the students participate. (As for the out of time filing, that&#8217;s a whole different issue &#8211; assuming the students had notice and could have filed within time I&#8217;d say bugger off).</p>
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		<title>By: S G</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12024</link>
		<dc:creator>S G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 13:39:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12024</guid>
		<description>Admiral,  Well done.  

As you well know supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Admiral,  Well done.  </p>
<p>As you well know supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Cloudesley Shovell</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12023</link>
		<dc:creator>Cloudesley Shovell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 13:33:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12023</guid>
		<description>I recall attending a CAAF outreach argument a few years back.  The law student who argued blew both military counsel out of the water.  

I agree w/Excalibur&#039;s comments*.  So long as the school takes things seriously (which unfortunately does not always happen) the Outreach program serves an excellent purpose.  

* But maintain that strange women lyin&#039; in ponds distributin&#039; swords is no basis for a system of government.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I recall attending a CAAF outreach argument a few years back.  The law student who argued blew both military counsel out of the water.  </p>
<p>I agree w/Excalibur&#8217;s comments*.  So long as the school takes things seriously (which unfortunately does not always happen) the Outreach program serves an excellent purpose.  </p>
<p>* But maintain that strange women lyin&#8217; in ponds distributin&#8217; swords is no basis for a system of government.</p>
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		<title>By: Wendell</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12022</link>
		<dc:creator>Wendell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 11:45:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12022</guid>
		<description>Anon 0000,

I&#039;ve got to respect your honesty, I gave you the negative props you are seeking.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anon 0000,</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve got to respect your honesty, I gave you the negative props you are seeking.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12021</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 11:35:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12021</guid>
		<description>This is a joke - both law student participation and CAAF going on &quot;Project Waste Some Money.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a joke &#8211; both law student participation and CAAF going on &#8220;Project Waste Some Money.&#8221;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12018</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 03:38:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12018</guid>
		<description>This is news?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is news?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: S G</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12017</link>
		<dc:creator>S G</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 03:02:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12017</guid>
		<description>Throw them into the bog!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Throw them into the bog!</p>
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		<title>By: John O'Connor</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12016</link>
		<dc:creator>John O'Connor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 02:37:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12016</guid>
		<description>I think it detracts from the seriousness of the proceeding.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it detracts from the seriousness of the proceeding.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Jackson</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12015</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Jackson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 02:26:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12015</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve seen this done as well at the 9th Circuit.  

Did both Amici write on the same issue(s)?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve seen this done as well at the 9th Circuit.  </p>
<p>Did both Amici write on the same issue(s)?</p>
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		<title>By: EXCELSIOR</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12013</link>
		<dc:creator>EXCELSIOR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 00:42:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12013</guid>
		<description>Most law students today are better than so-called &quot;REAL&quot; amici anyway.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Most law students today are better than so-called &#8220;REAL&#8221; amici anyway.</p>
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		<title>By: ManBearPig</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12012</link>
		<dc:creator>ManBearPig</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 00:39:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12012</guid>
		<description>EXCELSIOR!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>EXCELSIOR!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Excalibur</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12011</link>
		<dc:creator>Excalibur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Feb 2010 23:29:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12011</guid>
		<description>I could not disagree more, Fred.  This is a wonderful opportunity for these students to practice their craft.  And who knows, they may even help the side they&#039;re arguing for.  Some of you attorneys should remember how you got to where you are and who helped you get there.  Kudos to CAAF for letting these law students participate!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I could not disagree more, Fred.  This is a wonderful opportunity for these students to practice their craft.  And who knows, they may even help the side they&#8217;re arguing for.  Some of you attorneys should remember how you got to where you are and who helped you get there.  Kudos to CAAF for letting these law students participate!</p>
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		<title>By: Fred</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12010</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Feb 2010 23:24:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12010</guid>
		<description>It really steams my clams that CAAF will bend over backwards for some know-nothing law students (permission to file brief out of time...what a joke), but won&#039;t let a REAL amicus participate in oral argument.  What do some of you gurus think about this?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It really steams my clams that CAAF will bend over backwards for some know-nothing law students (permission to file brief out of time&#8230;what a joke), but won&#8217;t let a REAL amicus participate in oral argument.  What do some of you gurus think about this?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: No Man</title>
		<link>http://www.caaflog.com/2010/02/02/caaf-wont-hear-amicus-argument-from-nacdl-in-diaz-but-will-hear-amicus-argument-from-pepperdine-law-students/#comment-12009</link>
		<dc:creator>No Man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Feb 2010 22:42:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.caaflog.com/?p=4500#comment-12009</guid>
		<description>Groan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Groan.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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