[First I know it wasn’t a debate, so don’t hit send on that hate mail you are drafting]

From the Republican Presidential candidate, per NPR (here):

The Pentagon has to set up a “court system within the military,” . . . One today “practically doesn’t exist … Right now, part of the problem is nobody gets prosecuted. You have reported and — the gentleman can tell you, you have the report of rape and nobody gets prosecuted. There are no consequences. … Look at the small number of results. I mean, that’s part of the problem.”

So what the heck has the Mil Jus system been doing for the last five years?  Because all I see them doing is dealing with the issue of sexual assault.

So this post squarely falls into the category of “Rants” because I just can’t take the fact that we have a Presidential candidate that has absolutely no accountability for rolling out a blatant falsehood. The Republican candidate is the political equivalent of Tommy Flanagan on this issue. It is not like the numbers aren’t available either.  See here and here and here . . . and that’s just 2015 numbers, you get the point.  So here are the numbers:

Of the 6,083 initial complaints filed last year, about 1,500 were “restricted,” meaning the victim was a service member who reported the assault but refused to participate in any criminal investigation and only sought healthcare and victims’ support services.

In 2015, military criminal investigators reviewed 4,584 “unrestricted” reports from victims who were willing to participate in a potential prosecution. . . .

After completing investigations, 2,783 cases were sent to military commanders.

. . . .
Commanders launched court-martial proceedings against the alleged perpetrator in 926 cases. Among those, 159 were closed because the alleged perpetrator resigned from the military, and 111 were closed because the case was dismissed in pretrial proceedings.
Of the 543 cases that ultimately went to court-martial, 130 resulted in not-guilty verdicts.
Of the 413 troops convicted at court-martial, 161 resulted in charges unrelated to sex assault.
In 254 cases, a service member as convicted of a sexual assault-related offense.

[edit:  So if the candidate is going to lob out this “nobody gets prosecuted” statement, what’s his solution?  That’s what campaigns are about.]  Let’s look at what the conservative Heritage Foundation and friend o’ CAAFlog, Cully Stimson, said about removing command authority as a way to achieve better success in sexual assault cases in the military:

The facts also do not support this argument. None of our allies has a caseload as large as the armed forces of the United States. Despite this caseload, our current U.S. system remains more effective than those of our allies. For example, the Army installation at Fort Hood alone has a higher conviction rate than Canada Defense Forces and is equal to the Israeli Defense Force in courts-martial for sexual assault offenses.  Most of America’s allies reported that removing the authority to prosecute from the chain of command has slowed prosecutions, and they saw no increase in the number of convictions under the new system.

Article here.  Is that what this candidate is proposing?  Please someone hold this candidate accountable when he just speaks untruths or at least force him to posit a solution to the problem.

31 Responses to “First Presidential “Debate” Features MilJus – A Glaring Factual Inaccuracy About MilJus. But MilJus All the Same”

  1. Zachary D Spilman says:

    Define sexual assault

  2. stewie says:

    On this issue? On every issue. I know more than the Generals on ISIS. Putin compliments me so I’m going to compliment him. A guy who has been cited for housing discrimination against AAs. Who has hired illegal labor to work construction as he lambastes illegal immigrants as rapists and murderers. Who’s response to every question about any problem is…there’s a big problem, Obama/Clinton has been terrible on this, just the worst, I’ll fix it bigly.  (How will you fix it Don? Don’t worry about it, it’s going to be great).
     
    I get it. Hillary is a liar. She’s shrill. She’s unlikable. But she’s competent. She’s not an arrogant, racist, sexist, idiot. She’s not going to be dangerous to this country. And if she’s as bad as you think, she’ll be voted out in four years and you’ll get the republican you want who isn’t an abject threat to this nation.

  3. DCGoneGalt says:

    Over/under on concerned defender taking stewie’s bait = 2 hours.
     
    PS:  MMJGAA17 = Make Military Justice Great Again Act of 2017.

  4. Defense Hack says:

    DCGG – Judge Efron is somewhere banging his head on a table.Zach – Actual definition or the cynical definition that the tired MJ practitioner posts pseudo-anonymously online?

  5. Mike "No Man" Navarre says:

    Here’s the full quote:

    QUESTION: Mr. Trump, I have a daughter who is interested in joining the service, but when she researched the military, she saw the stats on sexual assault and decided not to go. I have a concern about the rape of women in our armed forces. As president, what specifically would you do to support all victims of sexual assault in the military?

    TRUMP: It’s a great question. And it’s a massive problem. The numbers are staggering, hard to believe, even. But we’re going to have to run it very tight. I at the same time want to keep the court system within the military. I don’t think it should be outside of the military. But we have to come down very, very hard on that.

    And your daughter is absolutely right, it is a massive problem. But we have to do something about that problem. And the best thing we can do is set up a court system within the military. Right now, the court system practically doesn’t exist. It takes too long.

    LAUER: In 2013, on this subject, you tweeted this, quote, “26,000 unreported sexual assaults in the military, only 238 convictions. What did these geniuses expect when they put men and women together?”

    TRUMP: Well, it is — it is — it is a correct tweet. There are many people that think that that’s absolutely correct. And we need to have a…

    (CROSSTALK)

    LAUER: So this should have been expected? And does that mean the only way to fix it is to take women out of the military?

    TRUMP: Well, it’s happening, right? And, by the way, since then, it’s gotten worse. No, not to take them out, but something has to be happen. Right now, part of the problem is nobody gets prosecuted. You have reported and — the gentleman can tell you, you have the report of rape and nobody gets prosecuted. There are no consequence.

    When you have somebody that does something so evil, so bad as that, there has to be consequence for that person. You have to go after that person. Right now, nobody’s doing anything. Look at the small number of results. I mean, that’s part of the problem.

    Transcript here.

  6. Wannabe Kenobi says:

    Why isn’t he being held accountable?  Maybe he is.  It seems to me like 60% of the country refuses to give a 2nd thought to voting for him.
    Or do you mean you can’t take that the media isn’t holding him accountable?

  7. Ed says:

    The statement of Mr. Trump is the “Ranting of the Ignorant”

  8. stewie says:

    Bait? I mean every single word. It boggles my mind that any rational person cannot see the vast gulf between these two candidates and put aside even the most intense dislike of Hillary given the alternative is an unqualified, blustering buffoon who is either a racist/sexist/xenophobe or is wearing a racist/sexist/xenophobe’s uniform to get votes.

  9. DCGoneGalt says:

    The overs win, collect your winnings.

  10. Wannabe Kenobi says:

    You wished for accountability, and the Post gave it:
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/09/08/what-donald-trump-gets-wrong-about-sexual-assault-in-the-military/
    Except of course, it’s probably not the accountability you were looking for…

  11. stewie says:

    Wannabe Kenobi…I feel slightly offended at your username on this holiest of scifi nerd days…the 50th Birthday of Star Trek.

  12. Vulture says:

    Oh, c’mon Stewie.  We won’t need a military or its dingy justice system with that wall around us.

  13. k fischer says:

    Last night, my pregnant wife ran into the room when I loudly exclaimed “ARE YOU KIDDING ME?????!!!!!”  Then, she rolled her eyes and executed a swift exit stage left to finish brushing her teeth when I explained that this guy doesn’t know WTH he is talking about.
     
    It’s pretty clear that he knows nothing about the UCMJ or how it has been practiced over the past 7 years.  There is no way that any reasonable persons who know anything about the military justice system thinks that there are too few prosecutions for sexual assault.  The only too few prosecutions I see are those for people making false allegations and for the trial counsel who assist them in ruining innocent peoples’ career.  Adding back due process protections for Servicemembers is one area where Senator Rubio might have done much better.  If this other guy gets elected, then I think the UCI committed by President Obama might pale in comparison.

  14. Vulture says:

    Don’t say the name Trump around your pregnant wife.  There has not been a rule out on the correlation between him and Zika.

  15. Concerned Defender says:

    Guess I’m late to the party and owe the “unders” and apology for their losses. 
    Sex crime prosecutions is a fairly fine point and one not really many people understand.  Of Trump and Clinton, Trumps take is excusably uneducated, but not really too far from the truth.  Clinton, as an attorney, former defense lawyer, member of the Armed Service Committee, Sen of NY, and wife of Commander in Chief, should know better.  
    Let’s boil down Trumps statement:
    1.  “Set up a Court system, which practically doesn’t exist.”  I’d say that’s 1/2 correct.  Anyone here think that the Court system isn’t significantly broken in the military at the trial level, appellate level, and CAAF?  Sure, it’s technically “set up” but it’s far from healthy.  Run buy career JAGs, who are often quite biased.  Too few courts to handle the case loads, MJs who come out with some pretty “unusual” rulings, and stuff flies in MJ Courts that would be absurd elsewhere.  Appeals take FAR too long.  We ALL know that it’s broken.  Raise your hand if you don’t think that the MJ courts are in badly need of an overhaul.  From the career track biased Judges who nearly ALWAYS favor the government, the biased SJAs with a hand on the scale, the fairly biased Commanders, etc.  WE can argue the merits of those biases in contrast to GOAD, but they exist.  How about the 2/3rds vote to convict for a panel?  Is that not in need of an overhaul?  I would say a Court system does exist, but it badly needs an overhaul to the point where I have very little faith in the process…  Trump is half right, for reasons that I can quarrel about.  
    2.  “Nobody gets prosecuted” – well that is incorrect.  Clearly.  Probably 9 out of 10 Congress critters would parrot that. But that is the prevailing infected perception passed down by the TJAG, to Congress, to the media.  Can you fault Trump?  This is the soup d joir.  I’m sure all of us would educate Trump on this issue.  By the way, this issue impacts <1% of Service Members who make up <1% of the population – for context.  FAR from the top of real issues, frankly.  As much as I hate the injustice of wrongly accused, the bulk of the cases are handled fairly and professionally.  
    But let’s break this down.  We’ve all seen a variety of figures and perhaps nobody here places any faith in them.  “There’s lies, damn lies, and statistics!”  Mark Twain.  I believe anecdotally we can agree in the following trend we have all observed:
    Not long ago, there were allegedly less allegations of sex crimes.  This resulted in some non-prosecutions, some NJP, some Chapter 10s, and some Courts Martial.  The CM cases were pretty solid, and resulted in a near 100% conviction rate. However, the alternate disposition raised some eyebrows.  The rules and UCMJ were amended to make near mandatory prosecution of all sex crime allegations.  Allegations soared, and so did funding coincidentally.  New jobs opened up.  More money allocated.  And suddenly the raw numbers of CMs increased for sex offense allegations.  However, the garbage cases which would have otherwise been disposed of administratively, resulted in increased acquittals.  Now, the acquittal rate is far below 100%.  This gives the perception that “the military isn’t doing anything about it.”  However, I’d say that it is doing more and also more incorrectly.  
    As for Trumps statements – eh, they’re misguided.  Chalk it up to him and 99% that didn’t serve and aren’t military law practitioners.  Trump has almost no reason to even understand the finer points of the UCMJ at this point, and he’s fed figures by – guess who – the TJAG.  Not any Defense Bar.  Not CAAFLOG.  Not opposing views.  Trump gets the same TJAG report sent to Congress on this problem.  Hell, most Congress persons think it’s a big problem, and that the SJAs and Commanders are doing little about it.  Folks here are uniquely situated because we practice this pretty small niche area of the law.  
    How many people in the nation really understand or have cause to appreciate this issue?  A few thousand?  A hundred thousand?  Out of 320,000,000 people…  It’s been blown out of proportion in a lot of ways.  I see Trump’s statements as just being misinformed on the PROCESS.  That is fixable.  
    Conversely, let’s look at Mrs. Clinton (who is herself an attorney hopefully soon facing disbarment for LYING under oath to Congress, a Tribunal, in violation of various legal rules including 3.3 – truth telling and candor to a tribunal) and her statements within the LEGAL PROFESSION of which she should be somewhat of an expert, given she did practice criminal defense at one point.  
    In response to someone above saying she was “competent” – um.  NO.  That’s a big fat NO.  I challenge anyone to demonstrate her doing anything remotely competent of any bilateral bipartisan level of competence in her decades in public office.  There is simply nothing.  Nothing but failure, fraud, lies, corruption, incompetence, and being wrong most of the time and leaving a legacy of total ruin in her path (most would agree she was wrong on her vote to invade Iraq, she botched Egypt, Iraq, Syria, Iran, N. Korea, Russia, and her whole email service, lies to Congress, FBI/DOJ rule of law mess, Foundation corruption, and on and on…).  
    On this point of sexual assault, here is her her TRAINED legal assessment (which by the way she did not employ when she was a defense lawyer, defending a child rapist, nor when she aided in character smears of the dozen women that alleged Bill raped them) in summary.  Remove the entire UCMJ to the civilian courts, and all allegations of sex assault have a right to be believed.  Both positions are shockingly absurd both because of what they mean, and the speaker making them demonstrates a total failure on so many levels. 
    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/09/14/hillary_clinton_women_should_be_believed_when_they_claim_rape_have_to_increase_prevention.html

    “Today I want to send a message to every survivor of sexual assault,” Clinton said. “Don’t let anyone silence your voice. You have the right to be heard. You have the right to be believed and we’re with you.”  Clinton said women should immediately be believed, starting a process to “determination as to what if anything should be done about the claim that was made.”
    “I think that when someone makes the claim, they come forward, they should be believed and that is what starts the process and then there is a determination as to what if anything should be done about the claim that was made,” Clinton said.

    Let’s look at this Time article:  http://time.com/2895141/hillary-clinton-military-sexual-assault/

    “Hillary Clinton revealed a surprising position Tuesday: She actually supported Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand’s bill to take the handling of sexual assaults in the military outside the chain of command….MS. AMANPOUR: So, do you believe — hard choice — would you take this out of the chain of command?
    MS. CLINTON:Well, I supported my friend Kirsten Gillibrand, and she wanted to take it out of the chain of command.”

    http://www.lohud.com/story/news/2016/06/14/senate-vote-blocked-gillibrands-military-sex-assault-proposal/85869282/

    ““That we have 20,000 survivors of sexual violence and the Congress can’t allow for a vote is just a reflection of the (Defense Department’s) unwillingness to tackle this issue effectively and to accept the fact that they have a huge problem,’’ Gillibrand said in an interview after the 85-13 vote on the defense bill.”  “Hillary (Clinton) has already said she supports this reform and so, when she wins the presidency, we will be able to pass this reform because if the commander in chief decides it’s done, it’s done,” she said. “My goal is to have this as one of the first reforms she puts forth as commander in chief.”’

    On Balance – Trump’s statements are puppeting Congressional and public opinion.  I disagree, but grant him a pass for apparently not really being educated on the issue.  Conversely, Hillary is a former defense lawyer, current attorney, has been Sec of State, wife of Commander in Chief, NY State Senator, a member of the Armed Serviced Committee…. she most certainly SHOULD be dialed into this issue and she even gets is staggeringly wrong.  She is hopelessly inept beyond rehabilitation.  And a career track record of ineptitude, dishonesty, fraud, scandals and other abuses which would read like the Declaration of Independence frankly. 

  16. Concerned Defender says:

    Doh, wish there was an edit – 
    Correction.  Clinton said to remove the UCMJ out of Commanders hands, not to civilian courts.  I miss-typed.  Still a bad idea.

  17. Ganthet says:

    @CD:  “Of Trump and Clinton, Trumps take is excusably uneducated, but not really too far from the truth.”

    So, again, Trump is excused for his ignorance?  If he doesn’t know what he’s talking about, maybe he shouldn’t be talking.  The same goes for anything Clinton is not informed enough to speak on.  Reading “setting up a court system, which practically doesn’t exist” as him arguing that the MJ court system as merely broken is pretty tortured logic.  Reading his words at face value, assuming he isn’t being “sarcastic” again, is him saying that he doesn’t really think there is a MJ system.  Particularly when read in context to his assertion that “nobody” is prosecuted.  He isn’t just relying on Congressional or POD talking points that there aren’t enough or aren’t enough successful sexual assault prosecutions or that sexual assault complaints aren’t taken seriously enough or that alleged victims of sexual assault are retaliated against when they report.  He takes those talking points and dial them up to his usual “11” degree of completely unsupported assertions that are closer to lies than hyperbole.  Trump has repeatedly demonstrated that this is his standard tactic since he does not really know what he is talking about, which would make for dangerous, unpredictable, and woefully ignorant policy-making.
    And repeatedly defending Trump by tu quoquing anything Hillary said, especially about other topics, is not the point.  There are other candidates out there, even if they have no realistic chance of getting elected.  This is not a binary choice.   

  18. Concerned Defender says:

    I guess you can interpret Trump literally, sarcastically, or off-the-cuff.  I don’t interpret him as being “literal” that there is no court system and nobody is prosecuted.  He has a tendency to speak in generic or sarcastic terms.  As lawyers, we demand more precise language, granted.  He’s clearly not using precision in his response.  Again, this is an area where you or I are extremely familiar, but he isn’t nor has really ever had any need to be.  I have more faith he’ll be able to get educated and understand the real issues, than Hillary since she simply is not able to be rehabilitated for the reasons cited above.
    Analogy.  
    Trump is asked a question and doesn’t quite know the answer but gives an answer that is partly right, partly based on popular perception, and partly incorrect, and partly sarcastic.  All easily fixable through education and getting actual real numbers.  You want to blame anyone, blame the corrupted TJAG and TJAG minions who push this nonsense data to Congress… 
    Clinton however says her the medical problems she denies having are the reasons she can’t remember the criminal acts she denies committing, lies about having committed, lies about lying about having lied, all while bribing and lying her way out of prosecution, but saying that all victims of sex assault must be believed while persecuting those that made allegations against Bill… 
    Um, I’ll take my chances with Trump please and thank you.
     

  19. Tom Booker says:

    Shame on SNL!  Tommy Flanagan was one of the greatest jazz pianists (emphasis on the second syllable, if you please) ever.  Eric Jackson used one of his pieces on his nightly show on WGBH.  Boo Jon Lovitz!
     
    RespectRespectfully, LTB

  20. Concerned Defender says:

    @ Stewie.  Are you attempting to smear Trump or justify Clinton?  It’s not clear.  
    I doubt there is a single politician who doesn’t play the $ for favors game on some level.  It seems to be pretty much written into the world.  It appears Trump has participated in this favortism through donations. 
    Notably absent are any FBI investigations into him; absent are DOJ investigations; absent are the gravity, severity, regularity, significance, and wide-spread allegations of abuse of office, lying under oath, mishandling TOP SECRET Compartmentalized documents, usurping authority, side-stepping regulations and laws, misusing her office and taking effectively huge brides for access by foreign governments, lining her pockets and her husbands pockets, and lining their illegal Clinton Foundation war chest for personal gain, etc. and what now appears plainly that the Clintons either intimidated or bribed the DOJ and FBI to no-bill any indictment, in stark contrast to the plain video and audio recorded evidence and even Comey’s statements about the facts.  It is simply staggering… 
    Find me a powerful business person who hasn’t contributed to politicians, and I’ll find you a Unicorn.  However, the stuff Clinton has done and so far gotten away with is straight out of 1984, Atlas Shrugged, Animal Farm, Stalin, Hitler, and Mao’s playbooks…  Anyone who isn’t absolutely terrified by her candidacy and possible Presidency isn’t paying attention.  

  21. TC says:

    I’m confident that this will end with either Stewie or CD changing his preferred candidate.

  22. stewie says:

    That last paragraph shows you are unhinged, I’m sorry to be so blunt, but that’s just silliness.
     
    What isn’t “notably absent” from Trump is:
     
    Redlining housing discrimination against minorities
    Pyramid Scheme–Trump Network (oh wait no “multilevel marketing.”)
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/03/23/the-trump-network-sought-to-make-people-rich-but-left-behind-disappointment/
    Diploma Mill–Trump University
    Bribery multiple times
     
    That’s fact. It’s not a “smear.” It’s absolute fact. And every single one of those things are just things where he broke or bent laws.
    That’s not counting his time as King Birther. It’s not counting his racist statements about Blacks being lazy, Jews counting his money, or Mexican’s as rapist and criminals. It’s not counting his myriad misogynistic statements. It’s not counting his continual praise of Putin and even Kim Jong-Un. It’s not counting his casual suggestion that Japan and other countries should have nukes. It’s not counting his suggestion that he will make the military commit war crimes. It’s not counting what this diary is talking about. It’s not counting his attacks on a Gold Star family. It’s not counting his ban on all Muslims. It’s not counting his ties to the mob. It’s not counting his pattern of not paying folks. It’s not counting his multiple bankruptcies. It’s not counting the insane statement that intelligence officials told him through body language that Obama doesn’t listen to them.
     
    These are all things that are off the top of my head. I’m sure I’m missing stuff.
     
    But you’ve got emails, vague assertions of corruption with no actual evidence, and an unhinged suggestion that the Clintons bribed the FBI, the head of which is universally respected by both sides (but your Clinton derangement and rush to villify her has you casually accuse him and other long time agents of a crime because they don’t agree she must be guilty).
     
    So sure…you win.

  23. Concerned Defender says:

    @ Stewie,
    Just so I’m crystal clear, you think that Trump University, and whatever supposed failures that might entail, or unfounded nonsense allegations of “racism” is on par with the ****** Secretary of the United States taking bribes, mishandling and abusing her office, lining her pockets to the tune of tens of millions of dollars, setting up and maintaining an ILLEGAL – note ILLEGAL meaning YOU CANNOT DO THAT as in a VIOLATION OF FEDERAL LAW private email server for official business, LYING UNDER OATH to Congress about every aspect of it’s existence, and what the purpose was and what was ON IT.  Then DELETING 30,000+ emails following a COURT ORDER and SUBPOENA for the entire drive/server, thereby obstructing justice.  THEN slow leaks of evidence routinely show she LIED to the FBI about turning over documents, LIED about the devices used, LIED about the nature of the documents, LIED about having sent or received Classified documents (FBI Comey said over 110 were the highest level of Top Secret classification, and she had in fact NOT turned them all over), LIED directly and repeatedly to the public about all of the above, LIED about having LIED about LYING…  Good grief.  This is just a tiny snapshot of a single issue, out of dozens, with her.  
    How can any lawyer with two brain cells look at her and not see the total illegality?  Fraud?  Corruption?  And anyone with any military experience must see that this mishandling of classified documents is highly illegal and her explanation is at best demonstrating her ineptitude and at worse she’s a criminal. 
    And I suppose Obama endorsing her (after having previously said she’s incompetent to do the POTUS job), and Bill meeting with the DOJ, just a day before the FBI “non indictment” – that’s all just coincidence?
    The level of outright corruption has perhaps never been seen in American politics until the Clintons.  Anyone that votes for this corrupt shItbag Clinton is an absolute moron or hates our nation… 
    Oh, but wait, Trump said something mildly incorrect so we better bash him.  Good grief. 

  24. Shawn Spilman says:

    Kakistocracy (n):  Government by the worst or least qualified people.

  25. K fischer says:

     I saw on the Today Show that John Hinkley, Jr just got released.  Perhaps the debate should be about who would would make a better president, Pence or Kaine?  

  26. stewie says:

    Unfounded?
    http://www.salon.com/2011/04/28/donald_trump_discrimination_suit/
     
    He was sued by the Federal Government over it in 1973.  He filed a countersuit and said:
    He “accused the Justice Department of singling out his corporation because it was a large one and because the Government was trying to force it to rent to welfare recipients,” the Times reported. Trump added that if welfare recipients were allowed into his apartments in certain middle-class outer-borough neighborhoods, there would be a “massive fleeing from the city of not only our tenants, but communities as a whole.”
     
    He came to an agreement with the government to settle the case by agreeing effectively to stop redlining.
     
    3 years later, the government came after him again for not following through with the agreement.
     
    It’s absolutely “founded.” It’s not “saying something mildly incorrect.”
     
    I’d have a scrap of respect for your position on Clinton if you admitted the myriad ways that Trump was crooked, corrupt, and a liar. At least then I would be able to say that you simply prefer Trump’s policies while seeing reality. (Ignoring the fact that you’d still be supporting someone who is the darling of the alt-right).

  27. Vulture says:

    I’d vote for anybody on here for Prez but I am pretty sure you are blogging from a personal server.

  28. Concerned Defender says:

    I’ll fully acknowledged that Trump isn’t the best, or even near the best, candidate.  Sure he might very well have some skeletons.  Few, perhaps zero, people of significant wealth, power, etc. can get there without some shady dealings.  If that were the criteria alone, nobody would ever be elected for anything.  But you have to dig back 43 years, FOUR DECADES, to pull gotchas on Trump.  And they are pretty vague “gotchas” at that. 
    I’m talking about CURRENT EVENTS.  THIS ADMINISTRATION.  THIS DECADE.  THIS YEAR.  
    If you acknowledge the evidence – the current, undeniable proof, that Mrs. Clinton LIED to Congress, then if follows that alone should result in 1) disbarment [her husband was disbarred for lying to Congress under oath], and 2) Federal prosecution.  Just on that one singular issue.  And there are literally dozens of similar issues.  
    Now, do you think a person who is/should be disbarred or under federal indictment (which she absolutely should be) is fit for POTUS?
    Look Trump has his faults.  Find a candidate who doesn’t.  But in a contest between Satan himself, and Hillary Clinton, she *might* get my vote. 
    She will absolutely destroy what’s left of this nation, debt, rule of law, the 2nd Amendment, the SCOTUS, our standing in the world, etc.  Her “leadership” has led to ruin around the world with Iraq, Iran, Syria, refugees, ISIS, N. Korea, Libya, Benghazi, you name it.  A trail of bodies…  with more revealed almost weekly ….  
    If the best ya got against Trump is he hurt some feelings 4 decades ago, or perhaps he doesn’t understand the nuances of the UCMJ and military courts (why would he, really, having never had need to?), that’s not much.  It’s  very nuance issue, impacting a trivial % of the nation.  Important, no doubt, but relatively minor and easy to be educated on when the time comes. 
    Lack of education on this issue (Trump) v. lack of morals, leadership, competence and intelligence (Clinton).  BTW, we know Trumps colossal accomplishments.  I’m still waiting for anyone on the entire universe of the internet to share some of Clinton’s bipartisan universally recognized successes.  Afterall she was 1st lady for 8 years (then stole US property upon leaving – confirmed by authorities and they had to return it -, and lied about leaving “broke” from that office), Senator for a term or two (did nothing noteworthy), a member of the Armed Services Committee (no achievements), during those periods she did vote for the invasion of Iraq, which should annoy liberals that she’s a “war monger,” for an “illegal war.”  And as Sec State for a term she failed in her Russian Reset (embarrassment and inept), failed in her diplomacy in Iraq, failed in her advising to withdraw from Iraq leading to our current mess there, failed in preventing N. Korea from getting nukes, failed in dealings with Iran, leading to a deal for nukes (during Kerry’s tenure), failed in Benghazi leading to deaths which she then lied about, failed in Syria, leading to WMDs, deaths, ISIS, chaos, and refugee crisis now plaguing Europe and the US, failed in Libya creating the power and terrorist vacuum there… 
    So I ask, in say 2-3 decades of actual public offices or positions of power, where are these stellar achievements she SHOULD have under her belt. I see a trail of abysmal failures, dishonest, lying, corruption, death, destruction, mayhem… 
     

  29. stewie says:

    lol the bribes to the Texas and Florida AGs didn’t even happen 43 months ago, much less 43 years.
     
    #CDS

  30. Mike "No Man" Navarre says:

    You guys crack me up with this discussion on this thread.  Sorry to say this, but having now veered totally off topic I am closing the comments.